THE BIRDS CHAT page four July 12, 2002
Online Chat on The Birds, a comedy by Aristophanes. One of dozens of online chats by members of Ancient Sites studying the Greek classics in translation.

23:58 - Aphrodite
       Is "The Pressfield" a book or a play?
23:58 - Torrey Philemon
       How about Assembly Woman/Ecclesiazusae in August? ...
23:59 - Zoe
       An historical novel
23:59 - Zoe
If we're to do two, late August. But I'm in
23:59 - Torrey Philemon
       Last of the Amazons is here
23:59 - Aphrodite
       I've been looking into novels set in classical times (Trojan War period and such), and I've made a long list of "Books to read". Would anyone like a copy of that? I suppose we can read some of them for a future discussion?
07/13/02 12:00 AM
00:00 - Morgana Flavius
       But you guys go ahead and plan a chat on Aristophanes or other Greek play. Actually, July is a slow month for me - jobwise - and I don't think I will have the time to study the way I like another theme for a chat in August, September, October...
00:01 - Torrey Philemon
       Heh, heh, reading the blurb on Last of the Amazons, Aphrodite, it appears to be a ROMANTIC FEMINIST novel <-:
00:02 - Aphrodite
       LoL! That was me being a ditz. It's a writer and NOT a work.
00:02 - Morgana Flavius
       The Amazons interest me, but then again, I don't have the time.
00:02 - Aphrodite
       Romance and Feminism together? I've got to see
00:02 - Torrey Philemon
       Well I'm wracking my brain to figure out how to hook you Morgana. My primary interest has always been the Greeks -  and I went too far from them with the Romans for at least a year (not that I regret it, it was all very interesting) so now I have a lot of Greek catching up to do.
00:03 - Aphrodite
       Sounds a bit like Bradley's "Priestess of Avalon"...of course I haven't read that yet, but the descriptions of both books sound a bit alike.
00:04 - Zoe
       The romance part means they 'did it' LOL!
00:04 - Torrey Philemon
       Well what if we do Aristophanes' Ecclesiastusuzae (i'll never get that spelling right) in August and then decide after that......maybe the Amazon book later in the fall....and perhaps Morgana if you had three months to read it.....
00:04 - Morgana Flavius
       You are right, Torrey. You came a looooooong way with us with those crazy Romans (from Caesar to Tiberius). Lol, I think it's time to go back to Greek. I like Greek mythology, but not much the plays (tragedies/comedies)
00:04 - Torrey Philemon
       Myrrhine has already indicated that she'd like to do one of the other "female titled" Aristophanes plays later in the summer. I think she gets back in early August.
00:05 - Zoe
       When we discuss the women ones we shall come up with two abbreviations - Ecc and Thes. No one should have to learn to spell either of those
00:05 - Torrey Philemon
       Good idea, Zoe! Ecc and Thes!
00:06 - Torrey Philemon
       Zoe and Aphrodite, are you both up for Ecc in mid August? (about a month from now?)
00:06 - Torrey Philemon
       Morgana, would Last of the Amazons interest you enough perhaps? (I haven't read it so I have no idea how good it is apart from the reviews, but Pressfield is highly regarded)
00:06 - Zoe
       Fine with me.
00:06 - Morgana Flavius
       Thes reminds me of Thomas Hardy's Tess of the Duberville (or something like that) a great novel and a great movie with Natascha Kinsky
00:07 - Aphrodite
       Yeah, count me in. Ecc is not very long, about half the length of Birds.
00:07 - Zoe
       Ya'll get a date, I'm flexible (no life here LOL!)
00:07 - Aphrodite
       Ah! I read "Tess of the Dubervilles"
00:07 - Morgana Flavius
       Last of the Amazons... sounds like the Priest of Avalon to me. And I didn't like that one at all...
00:08 - Zoe
       I loved Tess, I even saw that one Torrey!
00:08 - Aphrodite
       I agree, Morgana. It sounds like Priestess of Avalon.
00:08 - Zoe
       I don't think so, it's got Theseus in it (the Amazon one)
00:09 - Zoe
       It's set in Athens
00:09 - Morgana Flavius
       Besides Penthesilea in the Iliad, weren't the Amazons mentioned or the subjects of any other classics?
00:09 - Torrey Philemon
       There's a 19th century play called Penthesilea.
00:10 - Aphrodite
00:10 - Torrey Philemon
       Well maybe we don't have to decide right now, esp. if we do one more Aristophanes play first. Can we decide on that? 
00:10 - Zoe
       Yes, I got that one when we were discussing it before and never got to reading it, and there's Homer's Daughter too, I never got to that one either (always behind)
00:11 - Torrey Philemon
       Of course I also wouldn't mind reading the Mary Renault Theseus novels again. It's been years. I think they're out of print though (Bull from the Sea etc)
00:11 - Torrey Philemon
       And Aphrodite, do share your book list. I'll give you the url of the one I made for my classes in a minute.
00:11 - Aphrodite
       Are there any books written about Medea? i'm just curious because I can't find anything other than the play itself
00:11 - Zoe
       That's what I was trying to think of, thanks Torrey, the Renaults! I liked those and I haven't read them in years
00:12 - Zoe
       I don't remember seeing a Medea one
00:13 - Zoe
       I'm in for the Aristophanes'ladies in August.
00:13 - Aphrodite
       Also, couldn't find anything on Andromache. Ah, they never have books about the characters I want to read about. :(
00:13 - Torrey Philemon
       I'm watching a Medea movie right now (last night anyway, but only watched half so far). A Dream of Passion with Mercouri and Burstyn.
00:13 - Torrey Philemon
       Some novels listed on my myth bibliography page at bottom
00:14 - Aphrodite
       Is it any good, Torrey? I would like to check it out.
00:14 - Torrey Philemon
       Richard just finished his novel on Briseis. I read it last week and "edited" it for him. <-: Which meant wrote a lot of critical comments which I hope he finds more helpful than hurtful. He's probably working on a revision now.
00:14 - Zoe
       One of the Troy ones we read had Andromache a lot in it - I'll make a note to send you my list of what I read at that point (and my opinions will be free!)
00:15 - Aphrodite
       Thanks for the link, Torrey.
00:15 - Aphrodite
       Thanks, Zoe.
00:15 - Torrey Philemon
       A Dream of Passion is so so. Not great but interesting. I've been going to and amazon marketplace and buying every movie I can find based on myth that is at a cheap price (generally used). Also got Judith ANderson in Medea but haven't watched it yet.
00:15 - Zoe
       I'd forgotten about that one, I hope you/he will let us know when it's out!
00:16 - Torrey Philemon
       Yes Firebrand had Andromache in it. Firebrand was really superb, better than Song of Troy.
00:16 - Morgana Flavius
       Sorry, I clicked on Torrey's link and the chat disappeared... I can't see anything on the upper screen...
00:16 - Zoe
       Oh I agree, Firebrand was the best!
00:17 - Aphrodite
       I already read "The Firebrand", which I enjoyed a lot.
00:17 - Zoe
       I think you have to have a seaparate window to do that here and come back to all of it. I fell into that trap last time Morgana.
00:17 - Torrey Philemon
       I'm reading Achilles now by Elizabeth Cook. It's quite well-written. Very short though, about 100 pages.
00:17 - Aphrodite
       "The Firebrand" is actually how I found you all. I was looking up info on that and came across your site
00:18 - Morgana Flavius
       Yes, Firebrand was the best fiction on Troy I ever read
00:19 - Zoe
       I read that and I have questions, only it's too late to think of them. It got awfully odd at the end.
00:19 - Aphrodite
       Has anyone read "Autobiography of Cassandra"? I've heard about it but can't seem to find it. It's a short novel about Troy.
00:19 - Torrey Philemon
       There's also Helen's Passage by Concannon and Troy by Geras. They may be for young adult. They're in one of my huge "to read" piles....Sorry you keep losing your connection Morgana. Again, is there anything Greek that does interest you?
00:19 - Torrey Philemon
       I did read a Cassandra novel once that wasn't very good but I'm not sure that was it, Aphrodite....
00:20 - Aphrodite
       I read "Inside the Walls of Troy" which was also YA, didn't like it too much. or at all. lol.
00:21 - Morgana Flavius
       Can't think of anything Greek now, Torrey. I guess that the caipirinhas are taking over now... (lol)
00:21 - Zoe
       I've not run into any of those 3, Aphrodite and Torrey
00:22 - Zoe
       And I didn't care for Inside either.
00:22 - Torrey Philemon
       What are caipirinhas, Morgana?
00:23 - Morgana Flavius
       Caipirinhas = Brazilian alcoholic drink made with lemon, sugar and a strong sugar cane liquor
00:23 - Torrey Philemon
       Ah here's the Autobiography of Cassandra.
It's my Molinaro. I read a Molinaro novel last year that was marvelous.
00:23 - Zoe
       Lucky you, Morgana, we only have virtual caipirinhas. That word looks alot lkie pirhanas - the killer fish - any relation?
00:24 - Torrey Philemon
      Ah, yes, that word had me thinking of crocodiles and man eating monsters!
00:24 - Zoe
       Oh, you missed the drinks tray Torrey, I hogged all the glasses before you came
00:24 - Morgana Flavius
       No relation at all. Caipirinha has nothing to do with piranhas, just similar sound.
00:24 - Aphrodite
       What was it called, Torrey? I feel i've run out of good fiction to read. lol.
00:24 - Zoe
       perhaps a 'killer drink'?
00:25 - Zoe
       Oh, I always have a couple of beers while we talk.
00:25 - Morgana Flavius
       I'd say caipirinha is our local version of Mexican margaritas
00:26 - Torrey Philemon
       So Aphrodite and Zoe, shall we do Ecc in August? (can't remember the title but am looking for it Aphrodite)
00:26 - Morgana Flavius
       It's very refreshing, as you have to drink it with ice
00:26 - Zoe
       I adore Margarhitas! Especially the contrast of the salt and the sweet
00:26 - Aphrodite
       I'm looking at your book list, Torrey, and "Till We have Faces" sounds interesting. Have you read that one yet?
00:26 - Zoe
       Name your day, I will come
00:27 - Morgana Flavius
       Our caipirinha has only the "sweet" part Zoe :-)
00:27 - Aphrodite
       Count me in for Ecc, Torrey.
00:28 - Torrey Philemon
       The New Moon with the Moon in her Arms. It's not at but is "somewhat" at the UK store.
Very well written. Maybe you can find it used faster. Try this great book site
00:28 - Morgana Flavius
       Well ladies, it's late for me. I have to go.
00:29 - Torrey Philemon
       How about Friday night August 16? We need a Friday or Saturday night for Myrrhine in Australia (and I'll be out of town on the 9th)
00:29 - Torrey Philemon
       So glad you came, Morgana. I'll wrack my brain to figure out how to seduce you into another chat in the future <-:
00:29 - Aphrodite
       Bye Morgana, 'night :)
00:29 - Zoe
       I'm so glad you came tonight Morgana. I've missed your insights. we'll find something for us all to read again, I'm sure
00:30 - Morgana Flavius
       Thank you Torrey. I'll try to come up with something that might interest all of us too.
00:30 - Torrey Philemon
       Till We have Faces is a great read, Aphrodite. CS Lewis is a beautiful writer. Come to think of it, I wouldn't mind reading that again. Erich Neumann has a great psychological interpretation of it too.
00:30 - Aphrodite
       Fridays are usually good for me, so that sounds find.
00:30 - Morgana Flavius
       Bye, Aphrodite. It was really nice having you with us too! Please do come back for more.
00:30 - Torrey Philemon
       If you're still there, Morgana, look at Till we have Faces. Cupid and Psyche.
00:30 - Zoe
       16th is fine with me
00:30 - Aphrodite
       Oh, so we can read that for a chat? *hopeful look* lol
00:31 - Morgana Flavius
       Bye Zoe!
00:31 - Torrey Philemon
       Great, 16th it is. I'll leave a message for Myrrhine.
00:32 - Morgana Flavius
       Ok, I'll take a look some other time, when I read the chat transcript. (So that you don't talk on my back) (lol)
00:32 - Torrey Philemon
       Well let's see who else is interested in Till We have Faces. It's been at least 20 years since I read it. I have a friend here in Boston who wants to read it too.
00:32 - Torrey Philemon
       G'night Morgana.
00:32 - Morgana Flavius
       See ya! And finish those caipirinhas for me, will ya?
00:32 - Morgana Flavius
00:33 - Zoe
I'll have a go at it, I have to find it though, though I have some Lewis in here...maybe?
00:34 - Torrey Philemon
Aphrodite, the bestwebbuys site has several copies of the Molinaro New Moon book listed.......
Do you have Till We have Faces, Zoe?
00:34 - Aphrodite
Torrey, if we read "Till We have Faces," I'm sure I can get a few of my friends interested in discussion too.
00:34 - Zoe
nope, the C. S. Lewis compiled volume lacks that one but I'm sure I can turn it up
00:35 - Torrey Philemon
Well, that may be a good possibility for early fall, Aphrodite.
00:36 - Torrey Philemon
Good grief. Even used copies are $39. I HOPE I have it somewhere.
00:36 - Zoe
Maybe it lives in libraries?
00:37 - Torrey Philemon
Bestwebbuys has a lot of listings for it. We're in luck.
00:39 - Torrey Philemon
A question about August chat on Aristophanes - I have to get up early 7am that Saturday for an all day photoshoot so I'd like to start a little earlier - like 8:30 or so in the evening. That ok?
00:39 - Zoe
8:30 is fine with me
00:40 - Torrey Philemon
Looks like your in luck Aphrodite. At least Zoe and I seem willing to do Cupid and Psyche and maybe Morgana could get convinced. Plus we may be able to come up with additional people..... Probably time to end anyway, Aphrodite....... (the 8:30 time may depend on Myrrhine in Australia since she's 12 hours ahead of us and it would be 8:30 am for her)
00:40 - Aphrodite
That'll be 7:30 my time; I think it should be fine, but if not, I'll just join you two a little later.
00:41 - Torrey Philemon
I'll list us in the chat room for 9pm with 8:30 pm for cocktails <-:
00:41 - Zoe
Maybe she'd like to see morning here and there
00:42 - Torrey Philemon
Actually Zoe my allday photoshoot that day is another sand castle festival. You have to get there by 8:30 am to get a parking space though and it's an hour away....More sand pictures to come!
00:43 - Torrey Philemon
Looks like we're all set though with 9pm official meeting time August 16th for Eccl and maybe Till we have faces in September.This was fun! Glad you've joined us, Aphrodite. And by the way there will be a transcript by the chat room which you can save.... Goonight all!
00:44 - Aphrodite
Thanks, Torrey. I'm glad I joined this group too. I enjoyed the discussion a lot. :)
00:45 - Torrey Philemon
(And it's great doing chats again, Zoe!)
00:45 - Aphrodite
If I find more people for "Till we Have Faces," I'll point them in your direction.
00:45 - Zoe
The Powells Til We Have Faces is Mine!
00:46 - Torrey Philemon
Congrats, Zoe!  Guess I better sign out now so you can have the last word <-:
00:46 - Aphrodite
LoL! okie, Zoe. I actually found a copy for 9.50 on Amazon. weird,
00:46 - Zoe
Goodnight Torrey! I agree, I've missed this.
00:46 - Zoe
yep, the Last Word will be mine. I have great patience.
00:50 - Zoe
I'm glad you joined us Aphrodite! More opinions are always better. *s*
00:50 - Aphrodite
Ah, bad time to get the boot, but I wanted to sign back on to say goodnight.
00:51 - Aphrodite
I'll see you in August then. Take care! 'night :)
00:52 - Zoe
00:53 - Zoe
Zoe's Famous Last Words

This time my final words will actually have something to do with our discussion. My favorite lines from this play were from the Anonymous translation:

Words give wings to the mind and make a man soar to heaven.

Exeunt all.

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